Comments on: The Working Poor Summary http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/ Wed, 08 Feb 2012 17:31:40 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1 By: Dale http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/comment-page-1/#comment-26804 Dale Fri, 29 May 2009 15:22:58 +0000 http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/?p=379#comment-26804 Rosie: D. Wann "Simple Prosperity" is being discussed at a great blog The Non-consumer Advocate, a frugal-environmental-nurse etc in Portland. (I'm also in Victoria) Traciatim: libraries will get any book you want from other provinces or even the U.S. for free (but they have to absorb the postage). And you can suggest that they order a particular book. (How much did I blow in my life buying books, paperbacks, cookbooks etc etc before finding out the library has nice shiny new books you can reserve and just pick up from your hold shelf.) Rosie: D. Wann “Simple Prosperity” is
being discussed at a great blog The Non-consumer Advocate, a frugal-environmental-nurse etc in Portland. (I’m also in Victoria)
Traciatim: libraries will get any book you want from other provinces or even the U.S. for free (but they have to absorb the postage). And you can suggest that they order a particular book. (How much did I blow in my life buying books, paperbacks, cookbooks etc etc before finding out the library has nice shiny new books you can reserve and just pick up from your hold shelf.)

]]> By: Traciatim http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/comment-page-1/#comment-4162 Traciatim Fri, 14 Mar 2008 10:48:48 +0000 http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/?p=379#comment-4162 I would but apparently my province doesn't have it available at any of it's libraries, at least according to their search page. I would but apparently my province doesn’t have it available at any of it’s libraries, at least according to their search page.

]]> By: Rosie http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/comment-page-1/#comment-4148 Rosie Thu, 13 Mar 2008 21:56:15 +0000 http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/?p=379#comment-4148 Ok, I'm de-lurking from Victoria... :) Tim I'd love to hear what you think of a new book called "Simple Prosperity" by Dave Wann (author of "Affluenza." My impression is that he tackles some of these questions, including where to actually put the money you have that you want to invest when you don't really want to support the system and its status quo. I haven't read it yet, but it's on my list and would love it if you did! Ok, I’m de-lurking from Victoria… :)

Tim I’d love to hear what you think of a new book called “Simple Prosperity” by Dave Wann (author of “Affluenza.” My impression is that he tackles some of these questions, including where to actually put the money you have that you want to invest when you don’t really want to support the system and its status quo. I haven’t read it yet, but it’s on my list and would love it if you did!

]]> By: stevey k http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/comment-page-1/#comment-4108 stevey k Wed, 12 Mar 2008 16:32:24 +0000 http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/?p=379#comment-4108 Capitalism brings economies of scale and ensures human capital is allocated where it benefits everyone the most. Someone overseas gets a means of supporting themselves they wouldn't otherwise have, and you benefits by getting something for less $. If I buy product X from local shop for $15 when I could have purchased it at Wal-Mart $10, what I've essentially done is paid the local shop the market price of $10 plus given them a $5 donation. Not everyone can afford that donation (and that $5 is probably better used donated elsewhere or remaining in the shopper's pocket). Capitalism brings economies of scale and ensures human capital is allocated where it benefits everyone the most. Someone overseas gets a means of supporting themselves they wouldn’t otherwise have, and you benefits by getting something for less $.

If I buy product X from local shop for $15 when I could have purchased it at Wal-Mart $10, what I’ve essentially done is paid the local shop the market price of $10 plus given them a $5 donation. Not everyone can afford that donation (and that $5 is probably better used donated elsewhere or remaining in the shopper’s pocket).

]]> By: Traciatim http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/comment-page-1/#comment-4107 Traciatim Wed, 12 Mar 2008 16:13:31 +0000 http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/?p=379#comment-4107 I think you are confusing capitalism with corporations. The corporations will do whatever it takes to make money. The people will do whatever it takes to spend the least amount of money. Capitalism isn't really the corporations and the corporations aren't really Capitalism, though intertwined now they aren't really the same thing. If the cheapest choice with the best profit was local goods, then McDonalds and Walmart would be sourcing local goods to each store. The problem is you can go to a farmers market and buy a local carpenter built chair and table set for a grand, or you can buy a similar item build in Malaysia for 300 bucks. If everyone was making the choice of the carpenter, then the Malaysian goods would stay in Malaysia. The purchasers have ALL of the power here, and that's capitalism. Unless everyone wants to change, then no change will happen. I think you are confusing capitalism with corporations. The corporations will do whatever it takes to make money. The people will do whatever it takes to spend the least amount of money. Capitalism isn’t really the corporations and the corporations aren’t really Capitalism, though intertwined now they aren’t really the same thing.

If the cheapest choice with the best profit was local goods, then McDonalds and Walmart would be sourcing local goods to each store. The problem is you can go to a farmers market and buy a local carpenter built chair and table set for a grand, or you can buy a similar item build in Malaysia for 300 bucks.

If everyone was making the choice of the carpenter, then the Malaysian goods would stay in Malaysia. The purchasers have ALL of the power here, and that’s capitalism. Unless everyone wants to change, then no change will happen.

]]> By: Silicon Prairie http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/comment-page-1/#comment-4104 Silicon Prairie Wed, 12 Mar 2008 15:24:09 +0000 http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/?p=379#comment-4104 Money may be the standard when dealing with strangers, but relationships also matter too. Just like someone with a high level of skill or training will find it easier to get a well-paid job, having good relationships with a lot of people helps. This is one of the biggest things that can get people past the "profit-first" mentality and I don't think that's such a bad thing. Another things to remember is that there's long-term profit and short-term profit. Companies built to be around in a century have very different behaviour (and a better chance of reaching their goals). Short-term thinking leads to short-term lifespans - like arbitrage traders some companies might seem to make a lot of money without doing much of value for others but after a while people usually stop giving them the opportunity. I happen to think that personal relationships are also the best level to fix things like being "working poor". Trying to change the economic nature of another country or even your country to benefit people far away is one thing, but most people don't have to drive 5 minutes to find someone they could help... Money may be the standard when dealing with strangers, but relationships also matter too. Just like someone with a high level of skill or training will find it easier to get a well-paid job, having good relationships with a lot of people helps. This is one of the biggest things that can get people past the “profit-first” mentality and I don’t think that’s such a bad thing.

Another things to remember is that there’s long-term profit and short-term profit. Companies built to be around in a century have very different behaviour (and a better chance of reaching their goals). Short-term thinking leads to short-term lifespans – like arbitrage traders some companies might seem to make a lot of money without doing much of value for others but after a while people usually stop giving them the opportunity.

I happen to think that personal relationships are also the best level to fix things like being “working poor”. Trying to change the economic nature of another country or even your country to benefit people far away is one thing, but most people don’t have to drive 5 minutes to find someone they could help…

]]> By: ELizabeth http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/comment-page-1/#comment-4102 ELizabeth Wed, 12 Mar 2008 14:19:00 +0000 http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/?p=379#comment-4102 We use ethical funds. Which perform really well, and it gives us just some level of comfort when you get these attacks of conscious. We use ethical funds. Which perform really well, and it gives us just some level of comfort when you get these attacks of conscious.

]]> By: traineeinvestor http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/2008/03/12/the-working-poor-summary/comment-page-1/#comment-4101 traineeinvestor Wed, 12 Mar 2008 14:13:54 +0000 http://blog.canadian-dream-free-at-45.com/?p=379#comment-4101 Well, yes and no. These are complex issues. Take buying local. At an economic level you may be supporting the people who work in your local community....but at the price of taking work (and its economic benefits) away from workers in other countries. I have no views as to whether there is a "right" answer to this issue. However, the economic benefits of free trade are well proven and pushing the "buy local" position to the point where it detracts from the economic well being of a wider group of people. At an environmental level, buying local is usually a positive - but not always. There are instances where buying imported is actually better from an environmental perspective. As depressing as it sounds, the only long term solutions to the continued environmental degredation of our planet are to accept a lower standard of material living, technological improvements and stopping population growth. Needless the say the political, social and economic implications are likely to be both controversial and painful. Well, yes and no. These are complex issues.

Take buying local. At an economic level you may be supporting the people who work in your local community….but at the price of taking work (and its economic benefits) away from workers in other countries. I have no views as to whether there is a “right” answer to this issue. However, the economic benefits of free trade are well proven and pushing the “buy local” position to the point where it detracts from the economic well being of a wider group of people.

At an environmental level, buying local is usually a positive – but not always. There are instances where buying imported is actually better from an environmental perspective.

As depressing as it sounds, the only long term solutions to the continued environmental degredation of our planet are to accept a lower standard of material living, technological improvements and stopping population growth. Needless the say the political, social and economic implications are likely to be both controversial and painful.

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